stdragon03

Coaster Event on 14th Feb 2010

29 posts in this topic

Hi Everybody I would like to invite people to our Coaster event at Warner Bros Movie World on 14th Feb. I will be hosting a breakfast, 1 hours ERT on Superman in the morning and event Tshirt plus entry to the park plus much more. cost is $135.00 per individual if those who are interested or would like to attend please register your interest to my self. i have only 70 places available. I hope to see you all their. eddickinson@internode.on.net Regards Ed Dickinson AKA stdragon03

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Can you tell me what the event is for? Does it have a webpage or anything where I can gain extra info? I think many of the members on here would be hesitant about sending money to somebody they don't know. In saying that though, I am slightly interested. However, I'd like a little more information first.

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Hi Ash and Gazza thanks for your question i understand your concerns about sending money to somebody you dont know I am establishing Australian Coaster Club we are a registered business and i can assure that we are intending to develop a good reputation with our members and the Amusement Park industry if anybody feel that we are misappropriating funds people can go to Fair Trading NSW and NSW, Australian government. We are based in Sydney our club is going to be mainly doing regular events and tours. I have been a proud member of this site since 2002/2003 i am like everyone else here a Coaster enthusiast having ridden coaster throughout America, Japan, Europe, UK and Africa. I have background in business and working with people with disabilities, music and cooking. i lost my job in July this year and have always wanted to be self employed and do something i love to do In regards to the event it is booked for 14th feb and is our inaugral event and it at Warner Bros Movie World. I have a flyer to go. So if you still have anymore queries you quite welcome to email me Thanks Ed eddickinson@internode.on.net

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It does check out as registered. Doesn't make it any more or less legit though. A business in the business of making money would want to be out there more than just advertising on parkz forums - i'd be looking for a website \ mailing address \ bank account held in the name of the organisation or corporation. Corporate trust \ Australian private company before I sent money anywhere.

Extracted from ASIC's database at AEST 13:35:20 on 15/11/2009 Name AUSTRALIAN COASTER CLUB Registered state/no. NSW BN98466060 Type Business Names Registration Date Unknown Next Review Date Unknown Status Registered Principal Place of Business not available Jurisdiction Office of Fair Trading, New South Wales
Now I just want to point out that while NSW Fair Trading has registrations, the business is not a legally trading australian business according to the australian business register. (www.abr.gov.au) There is no Australian Coaster Club registered on the ABR, nor is there an Ed Dickinson (registered in NSW). So while a registered trading name you have, a legal business, you are not. If I pay you your money, I have a legal obligation to withhold 46.5% of your payment, and forward it to the tax office. This might make it somewhat difficult to organise the event you plan when you only get half the money you ask for.

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Details seem rather sketchy... i'm as confused as you guys are... and what's a superman ERT? Early Ride Something? Keen to find out more from the creator of this thread. Though i think i'd rather spend $99 and get the vip pass.... unless this guy is hiring the entire park for the whole day, in which case i'd consider going if the queues would be nothing.

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ERT = Exclusive Ride Time (although there are some variations). ERT is something we as members of parkz have been dreaming of at an Australian park. Many parks in the US give ACE (American Coaster Enthusiasts) ERT just for attending, as they bring lots of people, who spend lots of money on parks each year. I'm sure theres somewhat of an extra fee, But doubt it would be the $135.00 x 70pax ($9450) that this proposal entails. I know MW does hire out their attractions outside of hours as part of a corporate hire\conference thing, and I don't think SE is $9450 for the hour. Factoring in group discounts for 70 pax on an adult one-day general admission of $62.50 - let's say a generous 30% discount = $43.xx per person, so we're left with $97 per person to cover T-Shirts and ERT. T-shirts would be less than $10 in that volume, so we'll knock $700 off as well. We still have over $6000 left to hire out SE for 1 hour. Now I don't know the rates that MW charge. I do recall what WLS charged to hire out their big tickets were about $2000 per hour. Even given the additional staffing (demon could run 1, as could probe, as could beast - SE would usually run at least 4 (two load including grouper, and 1 unload, plus tower), But your staff would cost you an extra $150 at most to come in an hour earlier - tack on say another $300 for maintenance personnel to be on hand an hour earlier to prepare the attraction, and you still have more than $5500 to pay for the running costs, and these people have paid for a days entry out of that anyway! Sorry, i'd rather just use my VIP on a weekday and wait the extra cycle-and-a-half between rides.

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High im sorry to say i have decided to pull the event thanks for your support. Those who are keen to know what i do my website will be done by the end of next week. thanks Ed Australian Coaster Club

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High im sorry to say i have decided to pull the event thanks for your support. Those who are keen to know what i do my website will be done by the end of next week. thanks Ed Australian Coaster Club
Now, Ed, There's no reason for that kind of tone. I'm not saying it isn't a good idea, but you've got to realise that:
  1. We've seen a lot of scams come and go
  2. We've seen a lot of concepts dreamed up that never came to fruition
  3. We live in a society today where people would sooner spit on you than offer a friendly word
  4. You pitched a concept without a lot of substantiation
A registered business name is one thing. A physically registered entity, recognisable and accountable for it's actions (such as a company or such) is a bit more reliable. Street cred counts too. Over the years, many members of parkz have handed cash (or even credit cards) over to Richard for merchandise, calendars, and premium membership to the site. He started with tangible items that could be bought through a reputable and established medium (cafepress) and moved on to less tangible items as he built up that trust with the members. Now, i'm not saying don't think big - by all means a big blockbuster event such as this is still a great thing to start with, but a little more security is necessary - for example - since the park would have to be involved with this deal (as it is after hours) maybe a little something from them that could be confirmed as legit. Maybe they would handle the financial transaction aspect (i'm not sure of the logistics but theres got to be something there). Among many other things, I moonlight as an event manager. I know certain things about organising events and the right and wrong way to go about things. Some of you out there know what my day job is, so you also know that I know the legal aspects of things like this. At the end of the day, all I'm saying is come forward with a product that is a bit more tangible, a bit more ready to launch, rather than promising things that may never happen. You've been a member for a little while, so you'd know the issues that were experienced with concepts such as:
  • Dream Nova
  • Underwater Habitats

So i'll leave it at that. I look forward to seeing what you can come up with. It would be great to see things organised locally on the scale of TPR or ACE - So don't give it up - and keep us posted on how you get along. If you had a little more consumer confidence, i'd be there in a flash.

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Thanks Alex for your advice i think i need to learn how to spell though (high). I didn't mean to come across cranky. When your new at something you dont see the big picture and i made a mistake by putting on the event. The other thing i had gone away from original plan. i am working towards setting up a company to specialise in coaster tours. To do this i will be doing tourism next year at college and this is going to be my project. Anyway im always open to advice or anybody got any ideas that can help me that would be great. thanks Ed :D

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You kind of missed Alex's point. People aren't going to send $1,000+ (or any money in fact) to someone who is simply conducting a 'project'. Start off with something simple. A forum, your own trip reviews and some video footage. Start small, and then organise a one-day event at a park (like your previously proposed trip). Do that a few times and then organise something bigger. Maybe a weekend at the Sea World resort which has a bus going between the various GC parks... Of course, you'll need to get a fair amount of participants in order to make it profitable. That's what I'd be doing. After all, Theme Park Review wasn't build in a day. :P

Edited by ash.1111

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I totally agree with you Ash. i am trying set goals. At the moment i need to concentrate in doing a good business plan and working on a simple website and learn as much as i can. I have a good idea or product its a matter of learning how to sell it the right way so i can develop a good reputation. Im open to advice and ideas thanks Ed

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I would just like to halt things here for a minute and ask that all of you take a step back of almost acusing Ed of doing something shonky when it is nothing of the sort. stdragon03 has been a member of this site for a very very long time, does exist and was actually at the only Parkz meet, before there even was a Parkz. Now whilst this event may not have been completely thought through, that doesn't make it dodgy at all. I happen to know MW charge rediculous rates to hire their rides and insist you take out a food and beverage package with minimum number to do so. I think everyone has just been a little too harsh here.

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Im sorry but im going to have to agree with Dj here on this over the past 2 months i have hardly even posted on the forums yet watched and noticed what each person is like and how they work in away. Speech patterns, regularity in argumentation/input to the forums or the way in which they input. I looked back at the earlier days of the parkz forum its funny back then arguments over petty stuff to major point making was slim to none were as these days its on a high. I speak for my self and many other members on here who have said the exact same thing here. There are a few members these days who all they do is put everyone and the ideas, concepts and even enquires down as soon as they are said in order to prove there point and make themselves always look right. Im not sure if its a power thing or maybe even makes them feel good to the fact they have to be on top of everyone and everything. But it creates a negative feel as to part of the reason a lot of the regulars that say 12 months ago would always contribute don't anymore. The site may get just as may views as it once did or even more now but its the opinion behind the views that now counts. I know my rant will fuel more and more conflict, but whats funny is its those who Iam talking about who will be the ones to show there true colours in my outburst in stead of takeing in the advice given or maybe even think about what i have said and consider it. But i know these people are stubborn and won't.

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I simply stated my opinion, which was that people aren't going to send money to someone who they don't know. DJ, you mentioned that Ed was at the R-C meetup, and that's great! But that does nothing for me and most of the other members on here, as we didn't attend the trip. I am sure he's a great bloke, but I'm not going to send money to someone who I have no idea about. I stand by everything that I have said as I know that it wasn't intended to make Ed feel bad, but give him an understanding of how I felt.

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Just to clarify - I never said that Ed didn't exist. I only said that as a registered business he didn't exist. ASIC & ABR have no registrations other than a registered business name - which anyone can get with payment over the counter at a Fair Trading NSW office. I merely suggested the appearance of a lack of preparation \ lack of reliability given the current circumstances. I've been a member almost as long as Ed has (albeit with 10 times the number of posts). I've been wrong about things in the past, and will gladly admit when I am. As I said in my follow up posts to this discussion, confidence in the product \ some sort of safety net was the only thing, in my opinion, that was lacking. But I will argue a point that I believe is valid. To Nathan, as I can only draw a conclusion that you direct the bulk of your comments at me (given nobody else said anything remotely negative), I have - offsite and privately - made my own personal comments to certain people to whom a discussion was ongoing. As to discussion on the site, I do not believe I make anything but valid discussion points about the topic at hand. While we're making topical observations about "certain members", let's not forget the tirade of abuse we underwent from a certain entertainment employee at WBMW who took a long time to get the point, and now sides with the bandwagon, making comments without merit. Back on topic, Ed, I got your PM, but my pm's get fiddly sometimes and I haven't been able to reply. My email address is here: r...@s...m.au

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Thanks everybody for their advice and support. How about we all collectively work towards to having an event at Movie world? Unfortunately we will have to pay for ERT on attractions but as the park gets to know us as a group and learn the benefits they will get from our events they will eventually reduce the cost or even give us the free ERT which is what we want. We just have to start somewhere and get a foot in the door. I would like to see people here of this forum become more active than just chatting over the internet. So the first question who would be interested in having a coaster event at Movie World? Ed

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Well I started a thread a few weeks ago about a meet-up at Movie World and/or Dreamworld. Give me a shout on MSN as I would love to get something organised. ERT is great, but I'm sure we could get something else organised instead if it's too expensive.

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Well of course he exists guys :P I think the lack of capital letters etc is what put me off, it just seemed dodgy, you know how you get all those spam emails from Asian/Indians companies sent to your work address? If it ever did come to fruition though it would be fun :)

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Hi people, Just in regards to the pricing question. I am organizing a private party to be held at Movieworld and received a PDF booking file with all the pricings for events outside normal park hours. Pricing for ONE HOUR use outside normal park hours Batman Adventure - $3,000 Scooby-Doo - $3,000 Batwing - $2,200 Superman - $3,200 Wild West - $4,700 Lethal - $3,200 Shrek - $1,800 on top of this you also have to pay a venue hire fee which I have not been informed of costings yet. So - if stdragon is charging $135pp lets take a look at costings with 70 attendees $45pp for Superman Open 1 hour earlier $62pp for all day ticket maybe $5 pp for a event tshirt works out to around $110 total cost pp not including venue hire fee. neway - some info for ya :D Nate

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Nathan there is a problem in your math - the all day ticket pricing - your price is RRP, not group discount rate. For 70pax, WVTP would offer a group discount. I've no idea how much, and in my example above I gave a 30% discount. I based this figure on the price I paid when attending wonderland with my school, which is the only group discount i've ever had at a park. With a $50-$60 one-day ticket, we paid $16, which is between 70-75% off. Obviously this is a little too generous, so the 30% seemed like a good middle ground, and not too unreasonable. So with your attractions figures, $45 for SE, my group discount is another $43. I said $10 for a shirt, but it would really depend on the quality of the shirt and the printing, so lets go with $7.50 to split the difference. We've got $95.50. There's $39.50 left out for your venue fee, and considering the event would have purchased "all day" passes as well, i can't see the venue price being much more, since it would be before park opening, rather than after, and therefore most things that would normally be done for an event would be the usual opening day stuff, just done an hour earlier (+ the breakfast, which on normal continental catering would cost about an extra $4 per person, or $99.50 in total) I'm interested in seeing if MW would lockout some ERT during park hours - like the last hour (or the first) of the day for an attraction - this way, the park is open and staffed, there is no additional costs to the park, other than the ordinary running costs (maybe an extra cast member or two to control admission into the "exclusive" area). Attendees to the ERT make their own way into the park with daily or annual passes, and are granted exclusive use of the attraction for an hour. The park simply posts signage at the entrance (like they do when attractions are down unexpectedly, or for maintenance - to say "Superman Escape will close at 4pm today for a private function" ), and that way, guests are aware of the downtime, they have the opportunity to ride - just a little earlier in the day, and no-one can really complain when they were made aware of the closure before they accepted the terms and conditions of entry by passing through the turnstile. This way, no extra hours, extra maintenance, extra staff or security, no need for a food and bev package (your attendees are most likely going to eat in the park anyway). And they can charge a fee for the ERT to those attending (which would likely not be the $135 proposed here). We seriously need a public advocate out there to get the same treatment in Aus parks that ACE gets in USA ones....

Edited by AlexB

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I am VERY against closing an attraction for a private booking during park hours. That is really bad PR for the park. Guests pay their admission to enjoy the park in the open hours. Closing the ride for a private group is no different (probably worse) than just opening it late to save money. It looks really bad and guests do notice this kind of thing. What I find crazy is the park will not hire out the ride, just the ride with no extras if that's what someone wants. I don't see how when you cover all the operating costs (including wear and tear) you can't hire the attraction after hours. This would create good PR. Crazy I would urge anyone wanting to organise such ERT to contact operations or the park manager directly and no go through the usual guest services or events department channels. They may be more open to the idea, especially given the new managers come from US parks where this kind of thing is commonplace.

Edited by djrappa

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Rappa, I understand where you're coming from, but this is a common thing across many industries.

  • As you say, at overseas parks, it is commonplace to do such things
  • restaurants close to the public when hired for a private booking
  • i've been to bowling alleys that close when someone hired more than 75% of their lanes for a private booking.
  • school groups that hired Cables waterski park in penrith had it to themselves
  • certain celebrities close down a lot of a hotel's facilities because they want private use of the gym, pool, sauna etc
  • i used to take my dogs down to penrith regatta centre for a walk and a swim every afternoon, but when it was hired out for a school rowing championship, or some other sort of event, I had to pay to enter the centre, when all I was doing was walking the dog!

I do understand your point from a PR perspective, but seriously - take it in from the AVERAGE guest's point of view: I arrive at 10am to buy my tickets. The ticket booth attendant draws my attention to the sign on their window that says "Please Note: Superman Escapae will be closing at 4pm for a private function". I go, "ok, I guess i'll just have to ride it before 4pm then." As a guest, I am slightly disappointed that it won't be open all day, but it IS still open, and therefore I DO get to ride it. It is better than if the ride were closed for maintenance, where I wouldn't get to ride it at all. It's like the forever argument we have about theming. We moan and whine about the tiniest detail of theming that is off, but for the most part, do the guests notice? And if they do, do they care? For the most part, No. And American parks DO lockout during park hours. From what I read, it happens a lot for ACE and TPR, so why is it so different for Australia?

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