joz

Dreamworld should replace Blue Lagoon with...

26 posts in this topic

I've been thinking about this for a few weeks now, about what Ardent should do with the Dreamworld, and how they go about bringing it back.  Whatever they do at Dreamworld this year you can't imagine attendance returning to pre last year levels.  So if you're Ardent, and you're wanting to show confidence in the Gold Coast property, and invest to bring people back, while creating a proven new revenue stream, what what do you do?

 

As well as a modest family ride, Dreamworld should replace Blue Lagoon (and the amphitheater) with a Main Event complex.

 

Thoughts?

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Yeah great idea and it would have excellent flexibility to different attractions that the park could host but they need to move quickly on replacing the 3 lost rides ( TRR, Eureka and Rocky Hollow). Once that is done then a Main Event complex could be Stage 2 of this new area. 

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Thing is what a the return on a big coaster this year?  I would argue that the last thing Dreamworld needs right now is a Coaster. Movie World is adding an even bigger coaster, and Dreamworld adding a big 'scary' ride may still be an unpalatable option. I'd argue that a family ride (to replace the one they've lost, and to have something new to market) would be the way to go with the park, but if you're serious about the future, you bring your biggest brand to Australia.  I doubt it'd be possible to have it up and running by the end of this year, but I think it's what they should be looking into.

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47 minutes ago, joz said:

Thing is what a the return on a big coaster this year?  I would argue that the last thing Dreamworld needs right now is a Coaster. Movie World is adding an even bigger coaster, and Dreamworld adding a big 'scary' ride may still be an unpalatable option. I'd argue that a family ride (to replace the one they've lost, and to have something new to market) would be the way to go with the park, but if you're serious about the future, you bring your biggest brand to Australia.  I doubt it'd be possible to have it up and running by the end of this year, but I think it's what they should be looking into.

I'd suggest Dreamworld replaces Rocky Hollow and TRRR with a family ride, and replace Blue Lagoon, and possibly the Big Brother house with a big coaster. 

I agree with some posts above that a Main Event complex should be a Stage 2 development.

Edited by XxMrYoshixX

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Whilst I don't mind the idea in theory, i have a couple of stumbling blocks..

* ME would require a separate gate, which whilst no problem, would bring to the head where that would be, given initial plans for the southern side of Foxwell opposite to the town centre already includes an entertainment precinct leading into a new gate for DW. This precinct could already have AMF/M9 earmarked.

 

*i can't seen Ardent bringing its flagship US brand to Australian launch in the GC market. All previous AMF launches & concepts have launched into the Sydney market. It may also be too soon for them to want linkage with ME and DW, for purely US brand image reasons. I doubt any media coverage in the US of the TRR incident mentioned Ardent as owners, but had there been a ME centre next door I'm sure it would have been made, especially with the US sensationalistic media coverage 

 

* would a new concept entertainment venue next door not cannibalise some of DWs market, especially amongst families? I believe it would, especially in the short term given it would be viewed as a 'safer' option, 

 

id love to see an ME on the coast, but if it's going to happen I think it's far more likely in 2019-2020 after stage one of the town centre is opened and the surrounding precincts are being completed 

 

 

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2 hours ago, joz said:

Thing is what a the return on a big coaster this year?  I would argue that the last thing Dreamworld needs right now is a Coaster. 

True, but I guess I mean something that isn't just a flat ride thrown in somewhere. Be it a family ride, family coaster, etc, just something for families to replace the missing pieces. 

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There's been so much talk about this on this forum both before and after the TRRR incident.

We could go back to Gazza's coaster, or more recently, ideas raised since February include:

  • a Rainforest theme ( @Life ? )
  • a new Mountain/Mine theme
  • cart ride/runaway train/spinner mouse/RMC Hybrid all suggested (a large number of members)
  • Spinning Coaster ( @Santa07)
  • Drunken Barrels as an extenstion to Gold Rush ( @Slick)
  • A Saloon (Me)
  • Dark/Sinister area (you, @joz, before the accident)
  • Dark Ride (track or water - many members)

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On 02/01/2017 at 7:38 PM, Brad2912 said:

* ME would require a separate gate, which whilst no problem, would bring to the head where that would be, given initial plans for the southern side of Foxwell opposite to the town centre already includes an entertainment precinct leading into a new gate for DW. This precinct could already have AMF/M9 earmarked.

 

*i can't seen Ardent bringing its flagship US brand to Australian launch in the GC market. All previous AMF launches & concepts have launched into the Sydney market. It may also be too soon for them to want linkage with ME and DW, for purely US brand image reasons. I doubt any media coverage in the US of the TRR incident mentioned Ardent as owners, but had there been a ME centre next door I'm sure it would have been made, especially with the US sensationalistic media coverage 

 

* would a new concept entertainment venue next door not cannibalise some of DWs market, especially amongst families? I believe it would, especially in the short term given it would be viewed as a 'safer' option, 

 

id love to see an ME on the coast, but if it's going to happen I think it's far more likely in 2019-2020 after stage one of the town centre is opened and the surrounding precincts are being completed 

 

I've been meaning to reply for a couple days but, you know, life 


* 1 I'd envision a gate where the current entrance to the amphitheater is, and one into Dreamworld itself behind the train shed.

* 2  I think bowling and theme parks are different enough that they should compliment rather than compete.  One is a sports bar with arcade games and family activities aimed squarely at locals and the other is a national destination theme park.  I guess the comparison would be to something like Top Golf, no reason it can't work with the park.  Also since the costs for the land are minimal - utilities are already run, acquisition is basically zero, so it's a cheaper bet than a new site in Sydney.  

* 3 That's a good point about the Westfield development, integration would obviously be ideal, but I don't think it'd make or break it.  Having said that you also don't want to duplicate what they're doing and that's something that would need to be taken into account.  

 

Again i think it'd be a 2 year lead in, and a lot to think about, but I think it's well worth investigating 

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I'd be thinking something like a videogame world because there's not really a lot of competition for that theme right now, but the hard part would be finding a license.  Nintendo might be a nice idea, but is probably quite pricey.  If you could land a Minecraft license you'd probably do pretty well - the appeal seems to be fairly broad, and the theme is also fairly open to interpretation.  A bit of cross-over with Microsoft would probably do alright here, too.

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With the volume of land they have between Foxwell and the main park, I don't see a need to remove the amphitheater. They could perhaps put a show on and use it for something. I am curious as to what is happening in the 2 subdivided lots to the left (Current holding is 52 hectares, 33 have been sold off). The land to the right is what was sold off for Town center apparently.

Capture.PNG

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Reminds me of my Extreme World pitch in that it combines the natural allure of a major theme major in a growing residential area with the company's local entertainment skillset. There's a lot the company does really well in family entertainment that just hasn't been applied to Dreamworld.

I guess my only issue with the idea is that I don't see Ardent / Main Event as owners of the property much beyond the next few years. 

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Like I said in another topic @Life, DW can build on everything in yellow - not everything surrounded by the fluro green line. They can also built on the dark green sections but it has to not affect the surrounding environment too much due to it being the home of Oakey Creek.

On 02/01/2017 at 7:02 PM, joz said:

...Dreamworld should replace Blue Lagoon (and the amphitheater) with a Main Event complex.

Thoughts?

Like @Richard implies above, if that ended up being the case, I think that would probably mean Ardent Leisure would not sell Dreamworld (or Main Event for that matter) in the long-term.

On 02/01/2017 at 7:02 PM, joz said:

So if you're Ardent, and you're wanting to show confidence in the Gold Coast property, and invest to bring people back, while creating a proven new revenue stream, what what do you do?

Jamberoo recently introduced Photo Card - which simply is a small memory card purchased for $10 that you put into your phone/laptop & can instantly upload your ride-on photos to social media. If DW doesn't already do this, maybe they should? Have them take as many photos as they can off and on-ride & use Photo Card to get guests to upload them to social media. They get revenue plus free global publicity showing people enjoying DW's rides and attractions & when they start adding new rides/attractions, a little advertisement for the new ride/attraction with the DW logo in the corner of the photo.

Does anyone else think it would be odd if DW did end up demolishing a water park (Blue Lagoon) to build a new rollercoaster while also demolishing a rollercoaster (Thunderbolt) for a water park (Whitewater World)? They could have saved time & just replaced both in their respective locations :P

4 hours ago, joz said:

* 1 I'd envision a gate where the current entrance to the amphitheater is, and one into Dreamworld itself behind the train shed.

I've always imagined a new train station being located there as a unique entrance/exit to the park with the track before/after the station themed as a sort of 'wormhole' between DW & reality. This scene from Thomas & The Magic Railroad, which was a source of inspiration for this idea, bests show what I imagined (from 00:47 to 02:26 - the little reference to the 'missing coal truck' at 01:27 would be cool if DW did something similar with an old Eureka Mountain Mine Ride carriage) - just different environments at either end of the tunnel, no buffer stops & the 'missing coal truck' stays 'missing':

Edited by Jamberoo Fan

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The issue over whether Ardent\ME will continue to own Dreamworld is a sticking point, but I do feel a ME centre next to dreamworld would compliment it (as Joz says) as much as TopGolf will compliment MW.

We're never going to see our parks doing the long hour trades that the US parks do - it just isn't viable - however if the major parks had a night-time entertainment precinct to attract the night-time (older) demographic to stick around on property, it would be a win.

At the very least, it would be good to see DW use the studio\ampitheatre to host concerts - especially on the weekends \ during the summer - clearly not a headliner touring the BEC or similar, but a smaller, more intimate venue can still play host to many great acts - even if they did a battle of the bands or rock eisteddfod type deal.

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As much as Dreamworld need another roller coaster I think that the area should have some more family rides rebuild. 

In the recent years Dreamworld have built kids rides and thrill rides but no rides for the whole family young and old. The river rapids ride was perfect for that so I think another ride which caters for families young and old would be best.

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I think @joz has a ripper of an idea with putting a Main Event inside the old Ampitheatre. For many reasons it makes sense, and it's far enough away from the rest of the park that it would still be its own distinctive sports bar/laser tag/bowling/panic room business.

I think it's safe to say that this year no matter what Dreamworld build, it's not going to compete (at least in terms of thrills) with what Movie World's building. I'd love to see the land all the way from Blue Lagoon out to Buzzsaw either cleared out or cleaned up. I'd imagine all that land that sits infront of Giant Drop through to Buzzsaw would be great for a large Gold Rush stage, a new Gold Rush Food & Bev building and plenty of open space under the gum leaves.

As for rides, here's my picks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cHxqNFut2d8  

Intamin Water Coaster - you'll get wet, it's a worthy successor to River Rapids, and it has many marketable assets over Storm (the tilting elevator, two splashdowns etc.) 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qTyfn10c2c

Zampera Vertical Swing - great family ride, i've seen variants pop up everywhere recently overseas. Not over the top, not too thrilling either. Great filler for a space near the old Chairlift building.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yLByOaGachU

Gerstlauer Euro Fighter - They'd be crazy not to get one of these in their near future. They need, need, need, need, need an actually decent roller-coaster worth queueing up for, because up against Superman Escape and what they're building their roller-coaster offerings aren't in the same league. A marketable strength could be one like Smiler in Alton Towers that has a crazy amount of inversions i.e. "most inversions in Australia."

Edited by Slick

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I would have loved to see what could have been done with Storm if Sea World went with an Intamin water coaster instead of the mack model. Think of the lift coming out of the show building then dropping back in and out of the show building superman style. If Dreamworld went in this direction I'm sure they'd have a superior attraction on their hands.

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That Intamin one just looks really uncomfortable. Seems to bounce off the walls quite a bit, and what's with the immediate water ingress as soon as you leave the station? 

I'd like to see a fully themed track POV though instead of that one that looks like it was built as a demo/test product. 

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I've been a fan of entertainment precincts around MW and DW since I firsted visited CityWalk Orlando in 2009. Cinemas, Nightclubs, Restaurants, Bowling, Hotels very close by. I've always imagined this to not be inside Dreamworld's fence, but in the carpark in a way you can still see the entry building of the park from the M1.

To me, any land inside  the fence is for the park itself to use as rides and attractions. I'd rather BL and the Amphitheatre not be used for Main Event.

Edited by Glubbo

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7 hours ago, Slick said:

Gerstlauer Euro Fighter ... decent roller-coaster

Not sure that those two phrases go together...

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4 hours ago, djrappa said:

Not sure that those two phrases go together...

Not a fan? I really enjoyed Abyss and Takabisha. They're like Hyundai, great bang for even if they're still not a Mack Hypercoaster.

Edited by Slick

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Yeah, Abyss is great and currently unlike anything that is on the Gold Coast. There's enough different elements there to always be entertaining, unlike Storm Coaster. AW runs it well and there's usually hardly any wait. I think DW would do well to get something like it (or a bit more complex).

Could this have been the reason for Craig Davidson's visit at the start of the season?

Do we think DW will play it conservatively in its future CapEx spends? Will they avoid big thrill rides and river raft rides and aim for something more Disneyesque,  like dark rides and transport rides? I think a show could be good or a reincarnation of their audio animatronic theatre.

Hopefully, they'll devise a master plan (a bit like Joz's marina pier idea for SW), where they might introduce one new attraction at a time over the next few years or so.

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