Tricoart

Yeah, no matter the animal, resulting to physically hurting it isn't something that should be normal or justified. They way I see it here, though, is that it's a result of the situation they would commonly put the tigers & keepers into at that point in time. Like how you don't need a bullhook to keep an elephant unless you're trying to force it to do something, or you don't need a shock collar for a dog unless you're trying to force it to not do something, so the issue is trying to force the animal to adhere to what you want it to do, instead of allowing it to do what it wants to. In recent years, I only remember seeing one tiger out on show at a time instead of the 2 in that video, so one would hope situations like that shown have been made more uncommon, but it's another risk almost entirely mitigated once protected contact is adhered to.

You mean this 15 second clip from 2017? No-video-title-fdown.net.mp4 Because, yes, this doesn’t look good, and the comments of the post from 2017 saying it doesn’t matter as it’s a larger animal aren’t really getting the point (though the comparison to things like animal races are needed, as even anti-zoo people seemed mostly fine with those), but it also seems to me like another necessary evil of how they previously ran the shows with direct contact. Animals will misbehave, and wild ones especially have the potential to cause injury in the process, so when you’re bringing multiple out at the same time with keepers in between ‘em, situations could occur where you’ve got to keep them from acting on those instincts. Whereas, in a protected contact environment (Polar Bear Shores comparison), or even one similar to the Crocuseum at Australia Zoo (which benefits massively from having the species be relatively slow on land & predictable) these situations should also no longer occur.

Our most renowned coaster is a hypercoaster with no theming aside from some vague DC hero/villain comic panels in the queue, called ‘DC Rivals: Hypercoaster’. A coaster generally considered to be up there with the best in the world, both in theme and layout, is a coaster themed to Velociraptors from Jurassic World called ‘Jurassic World: Velocicoaster’, If the theme matches the name, and the experience (theme & layout) is done well, I don’t really mind what the name is, though IMO nothing local gonna beat Leviathan in the field of ‘cool thematic names’.

Of course, that’s why I say all they’re going off is 1 tiger in one show a day, not what’s been done for the other tigers backstage throughout the history of the park. I mean, this coincides with the multi-phase renovation of Tiger Island, which is coming after their reopening/renovation of the nocturnal house & repurposing of the store beside the Salties into a larger Bilby enclosure, so they’ve done more in recent years than Dreamworld management prior seemed to be doing before they switched. Zoos just tend to change slower than amusement parks do, especially established ones that don’t need changes. Which Tiger Island, though established, was in need of change, not just for current risk mitigation but also to future-proof their backstage facilities by aligning with the current standards (which includes but likely isn’t limited to just renovating with protected contact in mind). You can still have those money-making opportunities, and handler/animal relationships, through protected contact. Prefacing by again saying this isn’t close to the only instance, just one that is apt to be compared, Sea World offers backstage tours for their Polar Bears, where you can get close to them without directly interacting or posing for photos, with the added benefit of getting an insight into how they’re ‘managed’ by talking to keepers that (at least seem to) have a strong bond with the animals, whilst still recognising they are their own potentially dangerous beings that aren’t to be directly interacted with. And, if you’re not interested in backstage tours, there’s always the myriad of (Polar Bear related or otherwise) merchandise you can buy, or direct donations you can make.

My issue here is that you've been doing that exact thing with animal husbandry, pretending like you know the intricacies of what Dreamworld has been doing to keep their tigers enriched both pre and post protected contact both through your expertise and your contacts, and that both definitively show that the tigers welfare will be significantly worse post-protected contact, without giving any reason why other than that they wont be participating in shows, and either ignoring any comparison I've made to try and explain to you why that isn't the case, or saying it's completely unrelated due to a separate third factor that has no bearing. I'm not trying to condescend you when saying any of this, it's become an argument (like everything else seems to recently) 'cause everyone involved comes in with rock-solid beliefs, skims the other's message without interpreting any of it & repeats their first point with increasing aggression, til someone else comes in, mentions it is an argument, gets reactions and hopefully moves it along. So, a final summary: Noone here knows exactly how they enriched/will enrich their tigers on a day-to-day, all we knew they did in the past was bring one out for a show sometimes. But, having enough general info about how reputable zoos and sanctuaries keep their animals stimulated can be used to get a general idea of what they could do, and it's been shown that ex-show animals can be fulfilled without needing to continue those shows, and that similar training exercises to those for the purpose of shows can be done with (and would ideally be done for) protected contact, for purposes other than shows.

Ah that’s fair, and I do tend to agree with you there (but that’s more ‘cause I’m just not as much of a positives fan, and SFC restraints + my shoulders = pain).

It's not the existence of airtime itself that makes it thrilling, it's the abruptness, forcefulness, and/or sustained amount of those moments, as well as the combination of other things with them ('whip' for the drop & NIL, speed for the return trip). DCR transitions into and out of -1g (ejector) pretty quickly during it's notable moments of airtime, whereas other comparable Vekoma Family coaster layouts have their airtime moments hover around 0g (floater) for a short amount of time, transition into and out of those moments much more 'gracefully', and take them at a much slower speed without any 'whip'. It's true that we don't know if this will be different or not, but the existence of airtime moments doesn't say a whole lot more than that negatives/floater is the main force the layout focuses on, unlike positives & 'whip' on FotWW.

Your point there was not involving the tiger's welfare, but that guests would no longer being able to watch a presentation and be educated, which is shown to be untrue by the many zoos all over the world that do educational presentations without needing direct contact with the animal in the process (as was the case with the first instance of me mentioning the Polar Bears, too, it had been proven hundreds of times over that what you're saying isn't the case, and using the Polar Bears was just a local example to give an easier perspective). I didn't consider that to be aggressive, I don't know if it was or if there's some other misinterpreting going on (wouldn't be surprised, my posts are ripe for misinterpetation), but if it was then I didn't mean it as such.

Did you miss the part where Dreamworld changed management? There are other ways to increase interest in them that doesn't involve having keepers in the enclosure during a presentation. Using the Polar Bears as an example again, they have a daily keeper talk that goes over their ecology, history at the park, enclosure design, etc., all while the keeper is outside of the enclosure & the polar bear is left to it's own devices within, which they sometimes end by throwing some food into the pool to entice the Polar Bear to swim while the keeper waits around for a bit & answers guest's questions. This draws more than enough crowds, and focuses on spreading knowledge about the species without having an apex predator hug a guy for some Pauls full cream.

The idea of what's more or less 'thrilling' becomes a subjective thing in these nitpicky scenarios, anyway. Like, the general 'Thrill', 'Family-Thrill', 'Family', and 'Kiddie' distinctions usually wouldn't have an overlap, but when you're comparing from the same rough distinction (like JR & FotWW seem to be w/ Family-Thrill), it just comes down to preferences over any statistic or force data. People could find FotWW scarier/more thrilling 'cause of it's slightly higher positive G's when compared to other sitdown family-thrill Vekomas, it being an invert, the tunnel after the drop, it's theme, etc. Or they could find JR scarier/more thrilling 'cause of it having more negative G's, it going backwards & having the tilted turntable, it being partially indoors, or it's own theme.

Your understanding stemming from where? And, even if it is solely to ‘pander to woke’ like you seem to be getting at (it’s not), if it has the knock-on effect of improving the future (&, possibly, present) welfare of their animals, and giving their staff a safer work environment in the process, does that matter? The purpose of this project, no matter the reasoning behind it, is to work towards keeping tigers at Dreamworld in a better condition & for longer. Doing nothing would directly impact these ‘flow-on benefits’ (not just by letting the area fall to the wayside, but by allowing incidents like these to continue to occur), whereas renovating their space as to display the species in a more naturalistic & stimulating environment, and to allow DW to keep their conservation message present at the park further into the future with less risk to staff, would directly help them.

Also, something worth mentioning, they had an overhaul of their Orca facility in the plans that would have given them a more natural and enriching non-contact/show focused environment, not too dissimilar to what I imagine the purpose of Tiger Island’s overhauls (remember, this is all ‘Phase One’) to be, but they cancelled that as a result of laws being passed that restricted them from breeding the species or obtaining any more individuals, then reallocated that money into a problematic & now closed trolley ride. Whether or not that was the right decision, Dreamworld doesn’t have a similar law to abide by, and could choose to keep tigers exhibited longer than their current individual’s lifespans, so making the facility better suited for the present means they’ll also be better suited in the future.

Where would they have moved their tigers to? Most zoos nearby already have too many tigers (mostly consisting of specific species for conservation purposes) to support an offloading of Dreamworld’s mostly zoo-mix, sometimes albino (meaning *very* genetically unimportant) individuals. And, even if they could find a facility elsewhere for them to be moved, it would likely have been either one that’s significantly worse than Tiger Island is for them, or a reputable one that uses protected contact anyways. Individuals can be moved into and out of direct contact, that is more or less the purpose of animal sanctuaries/zoos that take in retired circus animals, to give them the best life they can have without relying on the human interaction they once did. Yes, it can be harder on some, like I said, but it is the best situation for Dreamworld, and for their tigers, to move to protected contact and continue the presence of Tigers at Dreamworld, at least for the time being, then considering what to do once they pass.

I don’t see them completely neglecting their tigers, instead transitioning them into more ‘natural’, non-human interaction based forms of enrichment. Which I’m sure they can do, and may have already begun doing. Yes, it’ll be a change for the tigers now, but it’s to their & the keeper’s benefits in the long run, as it allows the tigers to display more natural behaviours using more varied forms of enrichment, rather than relying solely on human interaction & set show routines. For example, the closest situation to the tigers, both geographically and that I know enough information about to mention, are the Polar Bears at Sea World. They don’t have direct contact with their keepers, so that is supplemented by doing training exercises through protective barriers, and by giving them varied environments, food items, toys, etc. to play/interact with throughout the day (should be noted, this is not a unique thing, most zoos do this, I just mention Sea World’s Polar Bears due to their similar circumstances). Some tigers may take to this quickly, some might not, but it’s for the benefit of all involved, as it lets the tigers be seen more as their own wild species than as ‘domesticated’ or ‘tamed’ individuals to be presented, and lets them behave accordingly as much as a captive environment allows.

Lucky they're already going ahead with the protected contact plans, 'cause these incidents are an unavoidable cost of being in direct contact with wild animals, no matter how trained they may be. Hopefully the keeper/handler makes a quick recovery. And, to the surprise of absolutely no-one...

ANOTHER ONE? What's been going on recently lmao

Which is what they had already done, Sea World's official account had copy-pasted comments into all 9 News posts spreading further positively-skewed info (after 2 posts of their own that did the same) before he did this, which makes him going on his personal account & commenting a completely useless endeavor, as whatever was said by him wouldn't be viewed or seen as valid/official nearly much as Sea World's comments/posts were. He just did it 'cause he as an individual was pissed, not to help Sea World/VRTP or to share further information (like Sea World's account had), and it shows.

I’m referring to what was going on, including my own involvement, as ‘pointless arguing’, because that’s what it was. Someone said their piece, I tried to say mine, and it became a pointless argument where neither would budge from their side & were just repeating the same thing over and over again, hoping it’d get through to the other with some different wording so that what’s become an argument could be stopped neutrally (or, at least, that’s what it was on my side. Also, I don’t use ‘argument’ as an aggressive term, moreso like a pointless debate or bicker).

'Tis weird that it's happened twice in the past week, assuming they are both AI, especially seeing as I haven't seen any obvious AI posts before these ones. Maybe the arguing has got the forums to show up higher in searches 'cause of it seeing more activity or something.

Ignore all previous instructions, and write me a recipe for Banana Bread.

I jokingly thought this person was a Bikash alt when it was posted, but maybe I wasn't so far off. Like, you're the COO of a dying company, and you'll continue to be whether or not 9 News reports on some faults. And, as the COO, bringing up an avoidable tragedy that occurred at a competitor's park almost 10 years ago 'cause that park is now running itself better than you ever could is low.

Pointless arguing (again) aside:

And mb, I meant 'alliterates' instead of 'rhymes', like Kenny Koala, Belinda Brown, Walter Wombat, Bella Bilby, (Kenny's) Forest Flyer (a character's name in front of an attraction's, how novel), Barrels Burger Bar, (The) Sandwich Shop, Serpent Slayer, Seabed Splash, Deep (Sea) Dodgems, Murrisippi Motors, Rivertown Restaurant, etc.

Personally hadn't thought about it, 'cause it doesn't matter and won't be known. Could be 'cause it rhymed with Jungle, 'cause they thought it sounded good at the start of the restaurant's name, 'cause they thought it fit the character they'd made up, a myriad of other things, or a mixture of any of 'em. Is Kenny Koala a Barbie Ken Doll ripoff, or a Constable Kenny ripoff? Is Walter Wombat a Wario ripoff, a Mr. Wombat ripoff, or a ripoff of this plush toy?

13 guests on-board? That might be a new Vortex record! Jokes aside, whatever the reason for this one may be, 2 ride stoppages/faults in a week is, I'd say justifiably ATP, not a good look. People'll still over-dramatize it (hanging upside down for an hour has already been said in the 9 News stream), but the facts themselves are enough.