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Dreamworld CEO talks thrill ride replacements off the back of Ardent Leisure cash injection

58 posts in this topic

19 minutes ago, CaptainLazerGuns said:

Please, prove me wrong.

What you're calling a negative bias and an echo chamber is backed up by investors, market analysts, and finance publications like AFR. It's backed up by social media comments in the wider public. It's backed up by attendance patterns and corresponding performance of the respective park operators.

At this point I don't think the onus is on this "echo chamber" to prove you wrong, when you've seemingly misinterpreted the article and then ignored every respectful rebuttal to your arguments.

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@CaptainLazerGuns, I congratulate you on holding firm on your position, and clarifying (in other threads) those points that have been misunderstood.

Through other means, I know that you don't share the same lean as many Parkz articles recently - and that is entirely your prerogative (I too disagree with the viewpoint Parkz puts forward from time to time - and am not backward in coming forward on that - the best part about that though, is that Richard is happy to discuss and debate respectfully).

It's important that everyone take stock and recognise that the articles published by Parkz are predominantly editorial (albeit well researched, and usually based in factual stats) - but as such, are the opinion of the editor. Like any major publication, the Editor has the choice of influencing and directing the angle that the publication takes, and whilst many recent Parkz articles have focussed on the negativity of Dreamworld's actions, it's hardly unwarranted.

It's ok to disagree with these articles, and to share your view on the issues at hand - but i'd like to pose one question (that i've asked myself when disagreeing with the angle Parkz has taken) - is the "echo chamber" really just nodding in agreement because they're mindless bobbleheads? Is it really an echo? Or is Parkz just saying what many of us are already thinking?

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@AlexB Thank you for respecting my stance and opinions.

In regards to your final comment, I think I know where it comes from. Many opinions on here aren't debated, they're attacked. I'm happy to have a discussion but in response to @Richard questioning why I haven't provided a rebuttal to some arguments it's because my words are picked apart and dissected to consistently keep me on the back foot and that doesn't constitute discussion in my opinion.

A lot of people don't have the patience to deal with that sort of behaviour and you end up with a community full of twitchy people with big sticks ready to whack whatever comes into sight.

I could respond in gifs, short sentences and 'lists' that entirely focus on one side of the argument but language was invented for a reason and I choose to use it. 

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As much as this forum discusses the negative things Dreamworld is doing, every thread, people will also discuss ways Dreamworld could improve what they are doing, ranging from realistic to wishful thinking to "never going to happen, but imagine if". This forum isn't Anti-Dreamworld, its just against running a park into the ground.

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Debate us then, have an actual argument about why you think we're wrong. Don't just say I disagree and you're too negative without backing it up. 'You say consistently quality attractions at VRTP yet they added Sky Flyer. You're giving them a pass for adding crap.' That would be an argument; an actual point to support your opinion. I've now made more points for your argument than you have. I might still disagree with you when you're done but at least you'll have made a point.

If you're not going to back up your position, I guess agree to disagree is the best we can do. I think you're wrong. That doesn't mean I dislike you or think all your contributions are invalid, but I think your opinion is not supported by facts. The article says 'DW have tentatively said publically something different to what they've been saying. Here's the context as to why they might be saying that, and here's why that's a good thing.' The article doesn't say 'DW says maybe thrill rides in the future. That's dumb'

Edited by joz
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1 hour ago, CaptainLazerGuns said:

Many opinions on here aren't debated, they're attacked. I'm happy to have a discussion but in response to @Richard questioning why I haven't provided a rebuttal to some arguments it's because my words are picked apart and dissected to consistently keep me on the back foot and that doesn't constitute discussion in my opinion.

A lot of people don't have the patience to deal with that sort of behaviour and you end up with a community full of twitchy people with big sticks ready to whack whatever comes into sight.

I could respond in gifs, short sentences and 'lists' that entirely focus on one side of the argument but language was invented for a reason and I choose to use it. 

Great points and very well articulated @CaptainLazerGuns.  

 

1 hour ago, Naazon said:

As much as this forum discusses the negative things Dreamworld is doing, every thread, people will also discuss ways Dreamworld could improve what they are doing, ranging from realistic to wishful thinking to "never going to happen, but imagine if". This forum isn't Anti-Dreamworld, its just against running a park into the ground.

Good point @Naazon. We know better than most, how far  and fast Dreamworld has fallen. Thats not to say that we want to see it close or shut its doors- for mine its the exact opposite. If we tend to focus on the negatives, for mine, its because there are so few positives in Dreamworld's current situation to balance these out. We ALL want a strong and viable Dreamworld, but most of us recognise that this is currently far from the case. We are all hoping that at some stage someone sorts out the predicament that Dreamworld is in and restores it back to its pre-eminence  in the Australian theme park industry. 

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23 hours ago, CaptainLazerGuns said:

I appreciate your response @joz. I'll throw my opinions out there to help further the discussion and get the debate going. I'm always happy to be proven wrong, even though I can be rather stubborn on my stances.

How long does it take to come up with examples?

Edited by Skeeta

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@CaptainLazerGuns, you've come into this discussion with vague assertions and straw man fallacies. Responses have been made to you in a rational, respectful manner.

I write articles like this to get people to think and react so I'm more than happy for respectful discussion/critiquing but as it stands all you've really offered is ad hominems about the community at large. Even that would probably be fine were you not claiming to be taking the high road while simultaneously goading members and dishing out bizarre pejoratives about lists and gifs (it's 2019?) that don't actually exist in this thread and rarely at all in these forums.

By all means share your opinions, but expect replies. This attitude of taking your ball and going home because others disagree really has no place here.

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2 hours ago, CaptainLazerGuns said:

Okay, noted.

snip

 

Easily the most gentlemanly posts i've seen on here for a while. Good on you, mate. 🍺 

After reading Richard's article, i'm cautiously optimistic. There's some huge hurdles Ardent needs to jump if they plan on holding onto Dreamworld for a while yet, but the cash injection rolling off the back of an uptick in crowds thanks to Consentino is definitely a good start.

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19 hours ago, Slick said:

After reading Richard's article, i'm cautiously optimistic. There's some huge hurdles Ardent needs to jump if they plan on holding onto Dreamworld for a while yet, but the cash injection rolling off the back of an uptick in crowds thanks to Consentino is definitely a good start.

Yeah Slick I agree 100% here. The cash injection ( fingers crossed it actually occurs) is the first sign that Dreamworld actually are starting to develop some sort of plan to restore the park somewhat to its former glory.  With the eventual opening of Sky Voyager , which should garner some more positive press for the park and renewed interest from the public, the park looks like it may be edging closer to turning a corner. However , that corner is QUITE large. Lets see how things develop, see what occurs, how the money is spent and what actually is purchased in the form of new rides ( and the obverse of that of course, seeing what effect that other rides removal will have- RE Wipeout).

As has been stated before, Dreamworld need to hit hard now with a bang and that bang should be in the form of a new large coaster. 

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26 minutes ago, Jobe said:

As has been stated before, Dreamworld need to hit hard now with a bang and that bang should be in the form of a new large coaster. 

Which would be at least 3 years away if you go by the article.  

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1 hour ago, Skeeta said:

Which would be at least 3 years away if you go by the article.  

Yeah easily, if not more. But if there is a plan for one , then at least there is some consideration by Ardent to still be in the game with Dreamworld for the mid term at least. If this occurs, then its a massive injection for the future of the park. However, for that to occur , they need to start planning that NOW . Lets hope that the scale of vision that we all hope can fix Dreamworld's woes can also be realised by Dreamworld's current management. As Slick says, cautiously optimistic, but there are a number of hoops to jump and walls to climb before we can breathe a bit easier for the future of the park.

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On 12/04/2019 at 5:41 PM, Jobe said:

Yeah easily, if not more. But if there is a plan for one , then at least there is some consideration by Ardent to still be in the game with Dreamworld for the mid term at least. If this occurs, then its a massive injection for the future of the park. However, for that to occur , they need to start planning that NOW . Lets hope that the scale of vision that we all hope can fix Dreamworld's woes can also be realised by Dreamworld's current management. As Slick says, cautiously optimistic, but there are a number of hoops to jump and walls to climb before we can breathe a bit easier for the future of the park.

I'm assuming that they've been planning for a while, and have just been waiting on the funds to pull the trigger. That said, for a new signature attraction it's Boxing Day 2020 at best, if there was a big manufacturer with an available window. It'd be shoehorning from the catalogue if so. 

I think a roadmap from DW would be helpful at this point.

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6 hours ago, Glubbo said:

I think a roadmap from DW would be helpful at this point.

Think if they do have a map they are using it would be based on the first release of Apple Maps.

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18 hours ago, Glubbo said:

I'm assuming that they've been planning for a while, and have just been waiting on the funds to pull the trigger. That said, for a new signature attraction it's Boxing Day 2020 at best, if there was a big manufacturer with an available window. It'd be shoehorning from the catalogue if so. 

I think a roadmap from DW would be helpful at this point.

The new CEO has only been in the job for less than 6 months and it's him that has brought the change in attitude towards thrill rides.

At best DW have been looking for a couple of months. 

 

Mr Osborne I have the contact details for Rocky Mountain Construction &  Bolliger & Mabillard to save you time.

RMC

0011 1 208 772 8181

info@rockymtnconstruction.com

B&M

41 244 721 580

info@bolliger-mabillard.com

 

Edited by Skeeta

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4 hours ago, Skeeta said:

The new CEO has only been in the job for less than 6 months and it's him that has brought the change in attitude towards thrill rides.

At best DW have been looking for a couple of months. 

 

Mr Osborne I have the contact details for Rocky Mountain Construction &  Bolliger & Mabillard to save you time.

RMC

0011 1 208 772 8181

info@rockymtnconstruction.com

B&M

41 244 721 580

info@bolliger-mabillard.com

 

No love for Intamin or Mack? 

Vekoma?? 😂

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We already have great Intamin & Mack coasters on the Gold Coast.  I want DW to stand out from the crowed with an real alternative like a RMC Ibox track or a B&M wing coaster.  Something you can put at the front of the park and be DW's trophy attraction. 

 

The ride needs to say "Take that Skeeta, DW is here to stay" anything else IS a waste of time.

 

@Glubbo

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Edited by Skeeta
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i'd be happy with an off-the-shelf product, provided it is of the type we don't already have here (such as the aforementioned wing coaster). The ride type would speak for itself, minimising customisation costs, and still delivering on wow factor.

Vekoma are great manufacturers - even Disney uses them extensively - but they use them because they can customise things EXACTLY how they want - and that comes at a cost. Plus, their ancestors are well known on the east coast (both Arrow and Vekoma coasters have long called Australia home)

As stated - Intamin and Mack are likewise long term residents on the coast - and its time for something different.

 

Personally, I think an amazing new woody would impress the market, and give one hell of a WOW on the highway (especially if it were to overtake most of the old goldrush, blue lagoon and BB ampitheatre area) - but they better get in quick before someone else steals the idea...

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I'd tend to think Vekoma's latest coaster efforts are among the best on the market. They are putting out some really solid rides as of late and I've heard nothing but good reviews from the ones that have been built.

Models that Dreamworld should consider are the Top Gun - a launch coaster that has a fairly fast paced Blitz-style layout. The other one is the Bermuda Blitz - a ride that some of you know as the Lech Coaster.

Honourable mentions include the Gerstlauer Infinity Coaster and the RMC Raptor.

I'd rather see Dreamworld go after something that is unique to them, rather than add another Mack hyper coaster to one-up MW.

 

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